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Frequently Asked Questions
Crystalyte Hub Motors Phoenix Roadrunner Sparrow PARTS HubFAQ Hub Main
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Are your systems water proof or water resistant? |
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| The motor is water-resistant. The controller is neither, and needs to be protected from rain. When you buy a kit, we wire it inside the power bag (pannier). Except in rare cases when ambient temperature is high and/or you are running it hard, the controller should stay inside the bag for protection. If you controller overheats, it may be necessary to move it to the bungees on top of the bag. | ||||||
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What is a "thermal shutdown"? |
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| Our controllers will protect themselves by shutting off the power in the event they get too hot. This will never happen to most people, but if it happens to you, wait anywhere from 1 to 5 minutes for cooling and the system will come back on. | ||||||
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Can I use my aluminum or composite frame? |
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| If you have an aluminum or composite frame, choose RoadRunner or Sparrow. The Phoenix motor is too powerful. | ||||||
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Can I use a front wheel motor with a suspension fork? |
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| RoadRunner and Sparrow are compatible with suspension forks. The Phoenix motor is too powerful for any bicycle suspension fork available. | ||||||
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How far can I go on a charge? |
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| This is
one of our most difficult questions because of the number of variables.
Consider these things: 1) Speed and range are inversely proportional. The faster you go, the less distance you will go on a charge. 2) Smooth tires will give better range than knobby tires. 3) High pressure tires will give better range than low pressure tires. 4) Hills, especially long and/or steep ones, use a lot of power. 5) Temperature affects range. Cold batteries shorten range. We get 9-10 miles from a Phoenix 4840, running in traffic as hard as we can. One customer reports 37 miles at 15 MPH with light pedaling, but we don't go slow, and we don't pedal, so our range should be worst-case. |
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What is your warranty? |
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| Motor:
180 days Controller: 90 days Chinese charger: 30 days Soneil charger: 1 year Batteries: 6 months Throttles: 30 days |
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How much does the kit weigh? |
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Our largest system weighs about 70 lbs,
the smallest about 45 lbs. The chart below shows the weights of motor and
battery. Add another 8 lbs for the controller, wiring, bag, and rack/basket.
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What speed can it maintain going up a moderate (10% or so) hill, with your test bike and a moderate-weight rider (150 lbs or so)? |
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| We don't think 10% is a moderate hill.. that is, 10% means going up 1 foot for every 10 feet traveled. That's a pretty steep hill - too much for most electric bike systems. All of our Phoenix systems will climb that hill, but we don't know the exact speed. Much depends on road surface and tires. Our guess is that the Racer would climb at over 20 MPH. | ||||||
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Does assembly involve nothing more than literally screwing things together? |
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| Assembly does not require any drilling. Our Home Assembly Guide will tell you what is involved. | ||||||
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The motor is directly connected to the wheel, right? No chain? I would imagine that the direct-drive motor, combined with the wheel's large diameter and thus slow rotational speed, would combine to make an extremely quiet vehicle, much more so than an electric scooter. Would you say that's the case? |
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| Yes to all questions. The only quieter vehicle we have ridden is the Tidalforce - you cannot hear it at all. Our Phoenix is the largest and loudest, but even at full speed with the wheel off the ground, it cannot be heard more than a few feet away. | ||||||
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It wouldn't be damaged by going over flat grass and dirt, would it? |
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| Because of the increased weight of the system, every part of a bike is under more stress. A 180 lb person with our largest system would put 250 lbs on the bike. That's within the limits of just about any bike made. A 300 lb person would put 370 lbs on the bike, over the limit of just about any bike made, and probably too much for off-road. Whether you ride on or off road, check your spokes frequently. Regardless of whether it is electric or pedal, off-road use is typically much harder on any vehicle. | ||||||
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Are modifications to the bike frame a certainty, or are there some bikes you can recommend that would not need new brakes or other components to handle 36 mph? |
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| We believe there are many, many good choices of bicycles, and everyone can find more than one frame or style that is comfortable and suits their needs well. The ability to offer choices was one of the primary drivers behind our initial investment in hub technologies in 2003. The approach we recommend is to visit your local bike shops. Educate yourself on what is available, and speak to the people about electric power systems. We caution that most bike shops still see their primary customers as traditional pedal bicyclists who want Spandex, high-dollar pedals, and a bike that weighs 10 ounces. If they don't like the idea of electrifying one of their bikes, go to a different store. More and more bike shops are selling our systems. They are finding a whole new set of customers, and those who are embracing electric power are expanding tremendously. Once you choose your bike, have the bike shop call us. They can purchase systems directly from our supplier. That way, you get a one-stop-shop. This approach may appear to be more expensive than a do-it-yourself plan, but it is cheaper in the long run for most of us. | ||||||
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Are you working on better batteries? |
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| Absolutely. EVdeals continues to invest in lighter, more dense battery chemistries. While there are NiMH and other types of batteries available from other sources, there are none that can run our Phoenix at full power besides SLA. While the RoadRunner and Sparrow can be powered from other battery types, we have not found one yet that is foolproof. That is, all of them require the user to monitor temperatures and actively participate in "battery management". When we introduce our NiMH pack, it will be the highest capacity pack available for an electric bike, and it will have electronics to do the battery management. Realistic timeframe is late 2006 or early 2007. | ||||||
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Can additional batteries be hooked up to increase range? |
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| Yes, but do not exceed the manufacturer's rating for the bike. Double the battery pack does not mean double the range because it also doubles the weight, meaning it takes more power to move it. | ||||||
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Are there advantages to Front or Rear wheel drive? |
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| Each has advantages and disadvantages. The rider is more aware of what the front wheel is doing. If it starts to spin, the rider has an additional plane of control. That is, you can turn the front wheel to maintain balance and correct for the spinout. The front wheel has less weight on it, though, so will spin more easily. Steep hills on non-paved surfaces can be a problem for this reason. Rear wheel drive has the advantage of better traction, but if you apply too much throttle on a turn and the wheel starts to spin, you will probably hit the ground as the bike goes out from under you (you can't turn the wheel as you can a front to try to correct for the slip). Rear drive puts the entire weight of the system on the rear of the bike rather than battery weight in back, motor weight in front. Rear dropouts on bikes are heavier than front, and can take more torque. If you use a rear drive, you can still have front suspension. Note that Phoenix is the only system with special frame requirements. RoadRunner and Sparrow do not produce nearly as much torque and can go on just about any mountain bike frame. | ||||||
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Can you explain "Watts"? |
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| A Watt is a measurement of power. It is
NOT a measurement of useful power. That is, an inefficient 600W system may
not accelerate as fast as an efficient 300W system. If a motor gets too hot
to touch by the time the battery is dead, it is wasting a lot of energy as
heat, and you get no benefit from that heat. An efficient motor wastes
little energy producing heat.
In technical terms, a Watt is Volts times Amps. A 48V controller that will deliver 40 Amps is a 1920 Watt controller (48 X 40 = 1920). This is the rating of the controller, not the motor. Motor watt ratings are not real useful in our application because motor ratings deal with continuous load at continuous speed. We do not believe Watts is a good measurement to use for comparing light electric vehicles because it is misleading. Instead, we use charts that show you actual on-the-road performance. A large diameter motor, such as the Phoenix, produces a lot more torque given the same amount of power as a small diameter motor such as the RoadRunner. That is, for the same amount of power used, the Phoenix will far out-perform the RoadRunner. I'm not sure why this is; I just know that it is. Perhaps it has something to do with leverage. |
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Can I use one controller to power two motors? |
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| With the Sparrow (brushed motor), yes, but it will cut in half the performance of each motor. There is no reason to do this. With the Phoenix and RoadRunner (brushless motors), no. The wheels communicate their spin rate and position to the controller, which uses that information to determine which set of poles to use to keep the wheel turning. Since you cannot synchronize multiple motors, you must use a controller for each. You can split one throttle to two controllers, however. | ||||||
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Can I use car batteries? |
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| They will work, but do NOT use them. A moving vehicle can find itself on a side or upside down. If you find yourself in this position, the last thing you want to deal with is battery acid. Use larger SLA / AGM batteries, not flooded cell batteries. | ||||||
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Do your systems have regenerative braking or pedal-charging capabilities? |
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| Regenerative braking, last time we researched it, is about 20% efficient. That is, you'd have to pedal 5 times as hard to generate power as you would to just pedal the vehicle directly. Regenerative braking adds cost and complexity to the system, while reducing reliability. When you charge batteries - particularly newer chemistries like NiMH and Lithium - you have to monitor the batteries' temperature and ability to take charge current. Failure to do this can result in battery failure and and/or fire except SLA batteries - the ones we have always used. Our approach is to build a better battery first, then develop a regenerative controller for use with our battery pack. | ||||||
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How many wires do your motors have going to the controller? |
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| Brushed motors (Sparrow) have two conductors, positive and negative. Brushless motors (Phoenix, RoadRunner) have three conductors for power going to the motor, and a 5-pin cable for Hall effect sensors. |